One thing I’d like to say is gazans don’t see themselves as gazan, they see themselves as Palestinian and refugees, they don’t want to live in Gaza, they want to use it as a launch pad to destroy Israel.
Worth noting
HooverInstitution on
At *The Free Press*, historian [Andrew Roberts](https://www.hoover.org/profiles/andrew-roberts) argues that Donald Trump’s Gaza plan aligns with historical precedent, in that aggressor nations that launch unprovoked wars and lose often forfeit sovereignty. From the Boer republics to Nazi Germany, Japan, and Argentina, military defeat has led to political upheaval, territorial loss, and forced displacement of defeated populations. Hamas’s October 7 attack on Israel follows this pattern, he maintains, making future Palestinian self-rule in Gaza untenable without significant political transformations. As Roberts argues:
>…historical precedent suggests that Hamas’s invasion of southern Israel that day, and its condign punishment by the Israel Defense Forces (IDF), have severe implications for whether the Gazans still have the right to decide their own destiny, and who governs them.
>For again and again in the past, peoples who unleash unprovoked aggressive wars against their neighbors and are then defeated—as the [Gazans have been](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-20415675) on any conceivable metric—lose either their government or their sovereignty, or both. It would be strange were Hamas somehow to buck this historical trend.
External_Trifle3702 on
This author repeatedly uses the word “unprovoked “. I’m no fan of Hamas, but is it accurate to say they attacked unprovoked?
boomerintown on
So what are we doing here? Justifying genocide?
Scary-Consequence-58 on
The Palestinians are a failed people. Israel withdrew from the Gaza strip in 2005 and the Palestinians thanked them by electing a terrorist organization as their first form of government representation. Even if the Palestinians had all the land back, they wouldn’t be able to govern it. It’s time we stop feeding these delusions. There are consequences to starting wars you can’t win. If I were the Prime Minister of Israel right now, I would say starting Saturday for every day a hostage is not returned we will annex another kilometer of land and keep going until either the hostages are returned or there is no more Gaza.
fpPolar on
The plan requires the Arab countries to accept the Palestinians. This plan also will cause people to associate accepting Palestinian refugees with enabling a perceived genocide of Muslims. At the end of the day, the biggest obstacle was getting neighboring countries to accept the refugees, not the US’s and Israel’s desire for this to happen. Announcing this plan publicly made that obstacle bigger and ironically made the plan less likely to succeed.
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One thing I’d like to say is gazans don’t see themselves as gazan, they see themselves as Palestinian and refugees, they don’t want to live in Gaza, they want to use it as a launch pad to destroy Israel.
Worth noting
At *The Free Press*, historian [Andrew Roberts](https://www.hoover.org/profiles/andrew-roberts) argues that Donald Trump’s Gaza plan aligns with historical precedent, in that aggressor nations that launch unprovoked wars and lose often forfeit sovereignty. From the Boer republics to Nazi Germany, Japan, and Argentina, military defeat has led to political upheaval, territorial loss, and forced displacement of defeated populations. Hamas’s October 7 attack on Israel follows this pattern, he maintains, making future Palestinian self-rule in Gaza untenable without significant political transformations. As Roberts argues:
>…historical precedent suggests that Hamas’s invasion of southern Israel that day, and its condign punishment by the Israel Defense Forces (IDF), have severe implications for whether the Gazans still have the right to decide their own destiny, and who governs them.
>For again and again in the past, peoples who unleash unprovoked aggressive wars against their neighbors and are then defeated—as the [Gazans have been](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-20415675) on any conceivable metric—lose either their government or their sovereignty, or both. It would be strange were Hamas somehow to buck this historical trend.
This author repeatedly uses the word “unprovoked “. I’m no fan of Hamas, but is it accurate to say they attacked unprovoked?
So what are we doing here? Justifying genocide?
The Palestinians are a failed people. Israel withdrew from the Gaza strip in 2005 and the Palestinians thanked them by electing a terrorist organization as their first form of government representation. Even if the Palestinians had all the land back, they wouldn’t be able to govern it. It’s time we stop feeding these delusions. There are consequences to starting wars you can’t win. If I were the Prime Minister of Israel right now, I would say starting Saturday for every day a hostage is not returned we will annex another kilometer of land and keep going until either the hostages are returned or there is no more Gaza.
The plan requires the Arab countries to accept the Palestinians. This plan also will cause people to associate accepting Palestinian refugees with enabling a perceived genocide of Muslims. At the end of the day, the biggest obstacle was getting neighboring countries to accept the refugees, not the US’s and Israel’s desire for this to happen. Announcing this plan publicly made that obstacle bigger and ironically made the plan less likely to succeed.