Hallo zusammen,
In Österreich ein Anwaltsschreiben wegen „Besitzstörung“ erhalten – muss ich wirklich 250 € bezahlen?
Ich bin kürzlich nach Österreich gezogen und habe gerade einen eingeschriebenen Brief von einer Anwaltskanzlei erhalten, die ein Unternehmen namens Haas Management GmbH vertritt. Darin steht, dass mein Auto einige Stunden (ca. 3:30h) auf ihrem Grundstück geparkt war und es sich dabei um eine „Besitzstörung“ handelte.
Sie enthielten ein Foto und eine „Unterlassungserklärung“, in der ich aufgefordert wurde, zu unterschreiben und 250 € zur Deckung der Anwaltskosten zu zahlen. In dem Brief steht, dass, wenn ich nicht antworte, möglicherweise eine Besitzstörungsklage eingereicht wird.
Es war ein einmaliger Fehler – alle Parkplätze waren voll und ich habe das Auto kurz darauf verschoben. Ich war im Ausland und habe den Brief erst später erhalten, sodass ich die Frist verpasst habe.
Ich denke darüber nach, ihnen eine höfliche Entschuldigung zu schreiben, in der ich die Situation erkläre, und sie zu bitten, die Angelegenheit fallenzulassen, aber ich frage mich: • Bin ich gesetzlich verpflichtet, diese 250 € zu zahlen? • Was passiert in solchen Fällen in Österreich üblicherweise? • Soll ich die Unterlassungserklärung unterschreiben oder auf die Antwort warten?
Vielen Dank im Voraus für Ratschläge oder ähnliche Erfahrungen!
https://www.reddit.com/gallery/1od1ucr
Von Techno_gp
35 Kommentare
[https://www.oeamtc.at/thema/vorschriften-strafen/besitzstoerungsfalle-75386938](https://www.oeamtc.at/thema/vorschriften-strafen/besitzstoerungsfalle-75386938)
>all parking spots were full
They weren’t. I mean you parked the car, right? You just opted for the premium option for nearly 1€/minute 🙂
*Yes, there are parking space traps and shady lawyer businesses around parking. Doesn’t seem the case here.*
Über 3 Stunden sind ja nicht Kurzparken oder „nur Umdrehen“.
since you parked there for hours I would pay. there has been some legislative movement on cases where people just turned on private spots or parked there for a few seconds. that is not the case here for you.
This is a well known Austrian Parking Scam by local lawyers. But apparently the legal system doesn’t want to do anything agonists this exploit.
It’s technically legal, but the intent of “parking place owner + layer” is to earn money through such pre-court settlements. They purposely buy privet lots in a busy area to scam, not to use
Short answer: you should just pay and sign the form.
If you don’t, the owner of the property will press charges against you what will result in not only paying a fine for the unallowed usage of his property but also have you pay the expenses of the process at court that can add up very quick as lawyers are not cheap.
Sucks but it is what it is – use it as a lesson to watch out where you park your car. Private property’s are often overwatched to ensure no unauthorized person is parking their vehicles there so the chances are high you get caught.
Yes that is unfortunately a scheme done atm by „semi criminal“ lawyers and their semi criminal clients, they basically earn a ton of cash with this scheme, not sure what to do atm than pay upfront or go to court, the government is aware of this and soon will close the legal loophole which allows this behavior! The bad thing is that the expected court costs are more than what the lawyer wants regularily but enough that they earn a ton of cash without any work involved!
Here is one of the reasons why everyone hates lawyers except for lawyers themsleves who are so full of sh*** about their reputation that they live in an entirely different reality. I have had this discussion with a lawyer yesterday. Absolutely unbelievable how detached he was about the reputation of his profession in general public but not the first one where I saw this. On the other hand they fail to reign in the black sheep exploiting loopholes permanently (because most of them would to the same if possible) for years and then when the government steps in they start to cry foul play, but yes „we are the good guys“, my ass…
But if you parked for hours they definitely have a case, because thats exactly what the law originally was written for, the problem is this scheme now has been hitting people who just were reversing their cars or people who were just shortly stopping on properties which were not properly marked (there was a hidden marker often, but hidden enough that you might miss it, or it was formerly a parking lot), and thats where it has gotten out of hand in a sense that even local newspapers gave fair warnings about certain spots being misused as cash cows by lawyers!
>Am I legally required to pay this €250?
Well basically no. These 250€ can be seen as an offer to avoid a regular court process. However they are not able to claim anything in court in case you paid and they still try to sue you.
On the other hand it could be that the court rules in your favor and you do not need to pay as they respect evidence. Could be does not mean it happens that way.
Take it as a bet: If you feel safe, decline the payment or any waiver and wait for what happens. If you dont feel safe about your chances, pay and be safe afterwards.
As these cases aren’t a 100% guarantee for the other party to be won, they also take the bet and hope you just pay. You see…its not black and white. Its just about who feels confident enought about their position.
It‘s good money for the lawyer, the property owner does not usually make any profit off this.
This is also standard procedure for illegal parking on private property…it‘s needlessly expensive, but meant to teach a lesson.
You‘d do best paying it and being more careful about where you park your car in the future.
These lawyers make money from these charges, so a polite apology probably isn’t going to be treated as anything other than an admission of guilt. If you’re member of ARBÖ or ÖAMTC you can contact them to get help.
See also:
[https://noe.orf.at/stories/3312818/](https://noe.orf.at/stories/3312818/)
[https://www.anwaltfinden.at/ratgeber/verkehrsrecht/besitzstoerungsklage-parken/](https://www.anwaltfinden.at/ratgeber/verkehrsrecht/besitzstoerungsklage-parken/) (note that this is a commercial website)
[https://www.wko.at/zivilrecht/besitzstoerung-allgemeiner-ueberblick-faqs](https://www.wko.at/zivilrecht/besitzstoerung-allgemeiner-ueberblick-faqs) (the other side…)
A polite letter won’t make them drop their case. There are several options to choose from, like talking to a lawyer or just paying the 250 euros and taking it as a lesson learned. Legislators are currently reviewing possible changes in the law, but for the time being, there’s not much you can do. Especially since you didn’t just stop there, but parked your car for several hours.
To keep it short: You basically have to pay it. You could take it to the court, but as you parked on a private parking space the claim itself is justified. Thus, you would waste your time and money on a lawyer etc instead.
It is frustrating, and also a bit of a d-move imo given the time. Yet, i have to admit that I have thought about the same way of handling ways myself. My company rents multiple fixed parking spaces for employees and customers as well and they are frequently occupied by other persons. I dont see a reason why I should accept that. I also dont park at their homes why they are away for work vice versa
More than three hours? Pay, sign, and tuck it away under „Lessons learned“. They will not yield, whatever you write. They made it a business model.
I once got a similar case which resulted in a 600 Euro payment because i drove into an empty parking space and turned my car. There was a tiny sign at the entrance which i did not see in the night (it said the space is only for parking at opening hours and it was at night). There are several newspaper articles about this practise called parking spot traps. The laywers earning good money with charging drivers for several hundred euros just for entering and turning.
Unfortunaly for you, since you really parked there for few hours, it does not even count as „trap“, so i dont think you can do anything legal against it.
You parked there for hours, pay it and save yourself the headache – you can only lose this one.
This is one the the reasons why Austria is not welcoming to people.
Everyone knows this is wrong, but it is allowed in society. Disturbing someone private is one thing, but shady gas station scams that are somehow legal are a fucking disgrace.
General legal advice is to pay and don’t do it again. In contrast to some fraudulent use of these laws for people who just turned their car on privat property, this seems to be a legit case.
Simply do not park on private property, look for a legit parking spot on a public street or get one in a garage.
Do you live in Austria?
You have to pay it. This has been covered in reddit threads and all major media channels throughout central Europe and not just in Austria. They are asking 250 Euros to not sue you which they will likely win and even if not, your costs will be so high you’ll look even dumber for trying to challenge it. In all likelihood, if you ignore it, you will be sued, they will win, you’ll have to pay 250 euros PLUS their legal fees and your own legal fees and any other potential usage charges they want to add in. People have a right to peace on their own property. You didn’t respect it and you have to pay. If this was the United States, the property owner would claim Castle Laws and shoot the person.
The concept here is that property owners have a right to peace on their own property and they not only don’t have peace, particularly in the cases where lines of sometimes hundreds of people a day are using their property to turn around, park, pick up pizzas, whatever, but it can also incur usage costs, like wear on driveways and sidewalks and such, noise pollution, light pollution, air pollution, and so on.
In your case, this isn’t a turnaround incurring 250 euro fines. This is you deciding to be asocial and leaving your car where it wasn’t wanted for hours because of your entitlement.
„It was a one-time mistake“
It was a one-time mistake for dozens of other people and how do I know the number is so high? A law firm deemed the number of incidents was high enough for them to take the property owner on as a client. Every entitled person thinks they’re the only one.
„all parking spots were full “
So their private property is now yours to use?
„and I moved the car shortly after. “
3.5 hours is not „shortly“.
„I was out of the country and only got the letter later, so I missed their deadline.“
Write them, explain you are willing to pay the original amount, but you were out of the country and only received the notice now.
Stop thinking the property of others belongs to you.
i had this too 2 years ago and according to a lawyer friend it is sufficient to send back „unterlassungserklärung“ – however you change it so it says you guarantee you won’t do it again & NEXT TIME you park there unauthorized you will pay a fee (not this time).
Because according to my info, a lawsuit will only be confirmed by the court if there is „danger of repitition“ (Wiederholungsgefahr), which is not the case after your „Unterlassungserklärung“.
I did just that and never heard from them again.
However, pls note, I am no lawyer and can’t guarantee any outcomes.
Edit: Here is a link that explains this procedure:
[https://www.derstandard.at/story/3000000237466/400-euro-wegen-besitzstoerung-so-kann-man-sich-rechtlich-wehren](https://www.derstandard.at/story/3000000237466/400-euro-wegen-besitzstoerung-so-kann-man-sich-rechtlich-wehren)
Good luck!
In general: yes, you probably have to pay. However, this passage seems highly problematic:
> Weiters verpflichte ich mich, die Kosten des außergerichtlichen Einschreitens in Höhe von 250€ zu ersetzen und [redacted] über Aufforderung der Rechtsvertretung der Haas Management GmbH auf meine Kosten einen vollstreckbaren Unterlassungsvergleich abzuschließen.
This means that paying the 250€ will not be the end of it and there may/will be further costs for the „vollstreckbarer Unterlassungsvergleich“ (enforceable injunction). I would absolutely not sign this before talking to a lawyer. If you pay anything, they must agree to not assert any further claims or ask for more money because otherwise, what’s the point of paying?
Pay it, 250€ is on the low end. Its not worth to figth.
There is a common „Legal scam“ where people get such letters for only passing someones property for a few seconds during a U-Turn. And even those often succeed.
Given that you parked there for hours I’d just pay up and pay more attention next time.
Sending an apology letter wont do much. The lawyer already sent the letter and he will charge someone for that work. If his client decides to accept your apology they themself would have to pay the lawyer, so they wont.
Also, many of these people are completely pissed off already. They might be nice and kind persons but if several times a week someone parks on your property you just get fes up. For each individual driver it is „just once and not for long“ but for the property owner it is probably the 15th time this month his property was disturbed.
I am sorry for your „loss“ and wish you wouldnt have to pay, but I also understand the other side.
I live in a central area in Vienna, where parking is scarce but highly sought after.
It is a daily personal theater for me from my balcony to witness the struggle.
There are alot of spaces in my street where parking is strictly forbidden. Mostly foreigners seems to ignore or don’t understand the obvious signage.
Weekly I see expensive cars with foreign plates getting towed. Or fights with the parking officers in English.
So I assume that Austria seems to have a more strict handling of this behaviors than people are used to in other countries.
And so I get a rare jolt of pride of calling this here home.
Go to a park and ride if you plan to visit the city. Or leave you car at home altogether.
Hey guys!
Thank you all for your input, advice and suggestions.
Lesson learned, never ever park, stop or enter a private parking!
– I talked to the owner/his lawyer and paid 250€ and they said its settled.
– Its my first time paying any kind of fine, never even got a speeding ticket before haha but yea lesson learned 🙂
Klassiker
I have a friend – lawyer – he got the same letter – requested a photo to prove and got one. The camera was positioned in a way which was not legal – he threatened suing them (GDPR violation etc) – the fine disappeared quite fast. (Only an option if you have the knowledge to play their stupid game.)
Fishy but legal. Pay, but do strike everything after *“… in der Höhe von EUR 250,- (IBAN ***) zu ersetzen“* before you sign their cease-and-desist, because that sounds particularly fishy.
Real question is if they had cameras and that u didn’t perhaps moved ur car.
They need to prove it in front of court.
If they don’t have cameras then just take 3 friends as witnesses and say u moved and they confirm ur story
Pay it… that has become a business model! Those people are just waiting for the next person to park there… you can’t win this fight.
You are lucky, a few weeks ago they could have charged you 400€. Pay it and be aware of that in the future. If something looks too good to be true like no parking spaces available but there is a completely empty space with no cars think twice. Are the others so stupid that they dont see the free space or maybe there is something fishy.
Pay it …
You will need to pay around 100€ and sign that you dont park there anymore. There has been a lawsuite from the VKI
Link below:
https://vki.at/system/files/2021-12/2021-12-15_PA_Kosten%20Besitzstörung.pdf
Contact me I can help you safe 150€
It’s a bit of a legal scam they run to make money.
Here’s your options:
1) do what it says
2) ignore them. Get a few more letters asking for even more money. Ignore those two. Risk being taken to court. You will loose in court and will have to cover the costs for the court BUT they will get less money out of you. Fuck them