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Beiträge wie diese lassen mich die nachteiligen Begriffe verachten "Charlis" Und "Charloua". Im Gegensatz zu diesem „Content Creator“ haben die meisten ethnischen Zyprioten der 2./3. Generation nicht den Luxus, als Muttersprache mit griechisch/türkisch geboren zu werden. Es ist stattdessen unsere Erbesprache. Erwarten Sie natürlich, dass ein ethnischer Zypriot zwischen den Generationen fließend einen Dialekt von einer Insel mit ca. eine Million Einwohnern spricht, die sie ursprünglich wörtlich gelernt haben, während sie in Ländern wie Großbritannien, Australien und den USA lebt, wo die weltweit globalste Sprache die gesellschaftlich dominante ist?
DNA Wise, Arent Cypriot Nationals und US/UK/AUS geboren ethnische Zyprioten genau das gleiche? Warum also ausgräben und Ihre eigene Art verspotten, anstatt stolz auf die Reichweite zu sein, dass die zypriotische Kultur weltweit über Generationen hinweg weltweit hat?
Ich kann nicht für ethnische türkische Zyprioten sprechen, aber ich gehe davon aus, dass es eine ähnliche Angelegenheit ist.
Ich begrüße uns ethnische Zyprioten dafür, dass wir versucht haben, sich in ein paar Worten zu bemühen und stolz auf unser Erbe zu sein. Wir wollen in den Urlaub nach Zypern gehen, in die griechische Schule gehen und uns unserem Essen und Traditionen gönnen, macht uns stolz auf unsere Wurzeln. Würde dieser Typ lieber den Dialekt überhaupt nicht benutzt, ihn überall aussterben und wir werden zu 100% Englisch und leben für den Rest der Zeit von Bohnen auf Toast, weil wir zufällig anderswo auferweckt werden?
Ich habe auch gehört, dass das Wort ‚Billis‘ verwendet wird … verspotten wir die gleichen jeerer zypriotischen Staatsangehörigen, die nach Großbritannien kommen, um in den Fisch- und Chip -Läden ihrer Verwandten zu bleiben, und können einen kohärenten Satz von Englisch beim Kauf von 3 Koffern im Wert von Primark zur Weihnachtszeit nicht festhalten?
2nd/3rd Generation ethnic Cypriots (Greek and Turkish)
byu/Pretend-Song7250 incyprus
Von Pretend-Song7250
12 Kommentare
It’s a shame there’s no resources for us to learn our mother dialect from other countries
I’m third generation, sadly don’t speak Greek (slowly learning), thankfully my Cypriot family are very welcoming and don’t view me as lesser due to the circumstances of my birth. (Granted my family are their only British family so I guess we’re a novelty for them)
I can’t see the post but I have been called this to my face (expecting me to laugh?) several times – despite speaking standard Greek at B2/C1 level!
Im lucky in that my mum didn’t speak much English when I was born so I learnt Greek before I learnt English (lived in UK all my life) so I can speak it pretty fluently, but even I get this Charloui stuff sometimes. Normally from someone who can speak English with an accent worse than the English accent my Greek has now after 30 years in the UK. It’s annoying.
The accent is a bit funny and it’s hard to get rid of, unless you live for a long time in Cyprus. Mocking someone for their accent is what poorly educated people do, they try to mock other to make up for their shortcomings. You shouldn’t feel too bad about this.
Now for resources on the matter I would suggest watching Cypriot or Greek series on YouTube. You pick up on how to pronounce words and most of these actors have correct, albeit sometimes local/specific accents.
It has nothing to do with DNA (not even the language!). Being Cypriot is about the mentality and culture.
Due to no fault of your own, if you grow up abroad, you will only have a limited, superficial exposure to Cyprus culture. You will be „out of touch“. This even happens to people who grow up in Cyprus but stay within „bubbles“ (e.g. english-speaking private schools, expat communities).
Don’t get too defensive about it. You may not be treated exactly the same as someone who grew up on the island, but you shouldn’t care about how random strangers treat you.
As someone who has lived most of his adult life in UK, I would not be surprised to be called Charlis. I would obviously defend myself vigorously, but I wouldn’t be surprised. My kids are definitely Charlis.
I see it as light-hearted teasing and not something to get upset about, and I can’t tell you how to feel, but I would encourage you to do the same.
For one thing, it’s definitely seen as a better and more respectable state than „my parent(s) are cypriot but I don’t speak a word of greek/turkish“.
However if it goes beyond the light-hearted teasing and into ostracizing as you say, then that’s just rude and prejudiced, totally agree. I haven’t experienced or witnessed this myself, but I can imagine that it happens.
I appreciate that you are not alienating yourself from Cypriot Greek, even if you still speak it with an accent or mixed dialect.
The fact that you are doing so, especially if you are trying to improve, is quite commendable.
About the language part, some might disagree but it is the responsibility of the parents to pass down their language to their children, so to a certain extent, it is the parents’ fault for alienating their children from their native language 🤷♀️ I am mixed Cypriot, second gen Russian/Ukrainian and I speak Russian like a native speaker because both my parents actively talked to me in Russian, even though I’ve lived in Cyprus until I turned 18. So I applaud those who actively try and maintain their roots despite the fact that their parents never actively helped them learn.
Anw about the Charlie thing, I am not a saint and to a certain extent, British Cypriots piss me off. I grew up near Dhekelia and their attitude can come off as snobbish and rude. I have the same impression of those living in the UK as well. I sympathise with those who try to stay in touch with their culture, but I can’t help but also judge those who try to overcompensate by being “aggressively” Cypriot to prove themselves. Perhaps recognising that you are not the same as those who grew up in Cyprus is a step towards enlightenment. I have also met B Cypriots who embrace their roots and their different upbringing, and they tend to be more down to earth.
Also yes, I mock Cypriots who are obsessed with the UK and worship Primark. Thanks for coming to my ted talk.
„Τσιάρλης“ and „τσιαρλούα“ are not demeaning in and of themselves. They can be used to make fun of someone based on context, but they can have a wide range of uses. They definitely come with more connotations than „Εγγλεζοκυπραίος/α“, but they’re not universally negative.
The reason why they’re seen as universally negative by many British Cypriots is that there is often a perceived dissonance between Cypriot reality and that which they themselves experience. They might feel out of touch with Cypriot society or they might be self-aware about their accent and the way they talk. So when they are singled out like that it gives the impression that what Cyprus Cypriots are doing is othering and excluding them. Granted, some Cypriots do actually do that, but it’s not really the norm.
This phenomenon is seen in the way you have perceived the video. A charitable interpretation of it is that it’s simply banter at the expense of British Cypriots for doing something that is odd to Cyprus Cypriots‘ ears. But to a British Cypriot it feels like mockery because they see it as „punching down“ on the part of the locals. There is this sense of „in these foreign lands I’m a Cypriot, and in Cyprus I’m a foreigner“ which doesn’t lend itself to self-deprecating comedy that easily.
What’s ironic is that Cyprus Cypriots have historically viewed this the other way around, which is why „τσιάρλης“ has a certain taint to it. Cypriots are a formerly colonized people who lived in abject poverty. When members of their community moved abroad or even to the cities and came back, they saw them as acting superior, an act which they understood as aping their colonial masters. So a „τσιάρλης“ is not really just a Cypriot living in Britain, but someone who is seen as having become more British themselves and by extension more alien for the closed society of Cyprus.
Attempts at speaking the dialect while being unable not to use English words with a British accent are not seen as an honest attempt at preservation of a heritage variety, but as this aping of the foreign ways which Cypriot society has instinctively closed itself from. There is this sense of „you are more like them, not like us“ which might fuel a sense of othering and disconnection. To Cyprus Cypriots, it is the „τσιάρλης“ who is privileged having followed the former masters‘ ways, so jokes at his expense is seen as „punching up“.
This is further fueled by very real phenomena of alienation of British Cypriots from the realities of Cypriot society and the persistent sense that Cyprus Cypriots are stuck in „old, rural ways“, that they are uncultured and less sophisticated than these Cypriots of the diaspora. British Cypriots might grow with a sense of being a minority in a foreign country, but that is different from a sense of cultural inferiority that Cyprus Cypriots are often subjected to.
As for this:
>DNA wise, arent Cypriot nationals and US/UK/AUS born ethnic Cypriots the exact same? So why ostracise us and mock your own kind rather than be proud of the outreach that the Cypriot culture has worldwide through generations?
Genetics never was and never will be a relevant factor in any of this. It cannot be used either to exclude or to validate anyone’s identity or sense of belonging.
>I applaud us ethnic Cypriots for trying to make an effort to code switch in a few words and be proud of our heritage. Us wanting to go on holiday to Cyprus, go to Greek school, and indulge in our food and traditions makes us proud of our roots.
As good as these all are, they are not the whole story. No one advocates against those and everyone here would agree they are beneficial. But engaging in them doesn’t mean you immediately get accepted into local society. This is the dynamic at play here.
>I’ve heard the word ‚Billis‘ used too…
I haven’t.
>Do we mock these same jeering Cypriot nationals who come to the UK to stay in their relatives‘ fish and chip shops and can’t string a coherent sentence of English when buying 3 suitcases worth of clothes from Primark at Christmas time?
The difference is that Cypriots who go to study in the UK don’t try to be British. British Cypriots are often trying hard to reconcile the two aspects of their identity which leave them more vulnerable to external comments. Cyprus Cypriots are quite comfortable in their „Cypriotness“, they have nothing to prove. British Cypriots often feel they have something to prove; sometimes due to their own self-perception of identity, and sometimes because Brits or Cypriots seem to question their authenticity.
I was really guided into learning and using ‚Athenian‘? Greek rather than a local Cypriot dialect. I think my father was ashamed of his accent and dialect 🙁 and wanted me to speak Greek differently. When I’ve tried using dialect, I get corrected by my family in Cyprus, along the lines of ’no, for you, you need to say kai, not jhai‘ (for example). Interested to see if that’s common with others, or whether that has changed over time? (My father passed away many years ago).
Identity is complex and it isn’t productive to validate it through the opinion of strangers. It’s a personal relationship that is decided by language, appearance, culture, and values. You are the arbiter of how those aspects come together to make up your identity.
As an example, my father is a born and raised Cypriot, but immigrated to the US as a young man. After decades in America, he views himself more as an American than anything else. However, some will hear his accent and see his darker skin and label him as a foreigner. Frankly, These people are morons. it isn’t up to them to decide how he wants to identify.
Conversely, I am very invested in my Cypriot heritage! I read about Cypriot history, keep up with current politics, cook Cypriot food, and (try) to speak the language. It would be ignorant for anyone to deny me my identity in just the same way it would be ignorant to deny my dad is an American.
In simple terms, not even Cyprus-born Cypriots are settled on what a “Cypriot” is. Everyone has their opinions and that’s fine, you are allowed to have your own!